Iraq's Salvation

There isn't a lot of faith in the Iraqi government. Destroy the IS leadership, and the same people who fought under Daesh will migrate back to Al-Qaeda. This is one battle that needs to be won by Iraqis for Iraqis.

Blackflag: How are you under that impression? They obviously have a government, and a pretty large military too.
Read this:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/30/AR2010093006546.html
It's 5 years old, but the point still remains. Their government is unstable.

History has proven that the more Western powers intervene in the Middle East, the stronger extremist groups become.
No seriously, I have about a dozen examples of radical groups who rallied the populace around anti-imperialist sentiments in the Middle East.
The fact is, if they attack and kill our citizens (or our allies, like Israel), then self-defense and retribution is in order.

And keep in mind what your proposal is. They attack and kill our citizens, and our solution is to do nothing about it and let them "take care of themselves".

Iraq's "salvation" HAS to come from Iraqi's.
Iraq doesn't need to be saved. It needs to be destroyed.

Krazy: I mean, Iraq doesn't have to necessarily attack the US, but they did attack Israel. And attacking our ally is like attacking us personally. And Israel is a special country.

Their government is unstable.
Yes, a government we imposed is unstable. Funny how that works.

The fact is, if they attack and kill our citizens (or our allies, like Israel), then self-defense and retribution is in order
Retribution is a fools gambit. I do not care of it.

If self defense is your cup of tea, then buy a weapon and wait for the time to come. Preemptive strikes are not self defense by any means.

Iraq doesn't need to be saved. It needs to be destroyed.
"Hey Jesus, what should we do about Iraq?"

"NUKE IT!"

"WHAT!!! Aren't there about 32.5 million unarmed non-combatants going about their daily lives?"

====
I despite fake Christianity. I also despise a nation in which people make claims such as "Let's destroy Iraq," and then go to church on Sundays.

Oh no! You are definitely not the first "so called" Christian to have advocated the destruction of Iraq. I have personally heard it on the internet close to 200 times.

Blackflag: Yes, a government we imposed is unstable. Funny how that works.
Oh well, mistakes happen.

Retribution is a fools gambit. I do not care of it. If self defense is your cup of tea, then buy a weapon and wait for the time to come. Preemptive strikes are not self defense by any means.
Either self-defense of ourselves or an ally, such as Israel, which they did attack before. Another reason is to take down a brutal dictatorship. There was reason to believe that Hussain would have supplied nuclear weapons to terrorists, which would then attack western world countries like the United States, so it was in effect self-defense.

I despite fake Christianity. I also despise a nation in which people make claims such as "Let's destroy Iraq," and then go to church on Sundays. Oh no! You are definitely not the first "so called" Christian to have advocated the destruction of Iraq. I have personally heard it on the internet close to 200 times.
So, instead of attacking my arguments, you attack me personally as a last resort. Stop with the ad hominem attacks. And just by the way, I'm not talking about genocide, I'm talking about the government of Iraq (not the people).

Either self-defense of ourselves or an ally, such as Israel, which they did attack before
Yeah, but so did every other nation in the Middle East. I think Israel is more than capable of defending itself against 8000 disorganized militiamen two countries away.

There was reason to believe that Hussain would have supplied nuclear weapons to terrorists, which would then attack western world countries like the United States, so it was in effect self-defense.
It would only constitute self defense if there was an attack to begin with. There were no nuclear weapons found in Iraq. This reasonable evidence was a torture confession...

So, instead of attacking my arguments, you attack me personally as a last resort. Stop with the ad hominem attacks.
Yes, ask others on this site and they will confirm that I attack other people, with justification of course. Screw modesty, bullshit needs to be called out.

I'm not talking about genocide, I'm talking about the government of Iraq (not the people).
What is your grand plan here then? Take down Daesh and destroy the Iraqi government? What's next, the establishment of another republic?

Blackflag: Yeah, but so did every other nation in the Middle East.
Correct.

I think Israel is more than capable of defending itself against 8000 disorganized militiamen two countries away.
That's not the point. The point is they are our ally, so they deserve our help. Yeah, they can take care of themselves, sure. They've been attacked by every muslim country around their borders and Israel humiliated them each time. They've been attacked by the Jordanians, the Syrians, the Saudi Arabians, the Iraqis, the Persians, the Egyptians, the muslims, the morons, etc. But the point is that we should intend to help.

It would only constitute self defense if there was an attack to begin with. There were no nuclear weapons found in Iraq. This reasonable evidence was a torture confession...
Waiting for them to attack us is idiotic. No, there were no nukes "found" in Iraq but there were WMDs for sure.

Yes, ask others on this site and they will confirm that I attack other people, with justification of course. Screw modesty, bullshit needs to be called out.
Unless you want to suffer the consequences from violating the site's terms and conditions, I would watch the language and stop cussing.

What is your grand plan here then? Take down Daesh and destroy the Iraqi government? What's next, the establishment of another republic?
Maybe, although that might be pointless, because they would just ruin it.

But the point is that we should intend to help.
From what? Do you think Israel is going to be attacked by Iraq through Syria?

Waiting for them to attack us is idiotic. No, there were no nukes "found" in Iraq but there were WMDs for sure.

Really? Care to elaborate?

Unless you want to suffer the consequences from violating the site's terms and conditions, I would watch the language and stop cussing.
Lol. I've been here a long time. The word bullshit isn't considered profanity on Edeb8.

Maybe, although that might be pointless, because they would just ruin it.
So you admittedly cannot see the big picture, but continue to preach both political and military intervention?

Blackflag: From what? Do you think Israel is going to be attacked by Iraq through Syria?
It doesn't matter who they're attacked by. The point is that they are our special ally and we should be there with them. Whether be in the form of monetary aid or weapons supply or military support. One of America's greatest achievements is it's unwavering support of Israel; in my completely unbiased and usually correct opinion.

Really? Care to elaborate?
Elaborate on what? Be more specific.

Lol. I've been here a long time. The word bullshit isn't considered profanity on Edeb8.
Weird.

So you admittedly cannot see the big picture, but continue to preach both political and military intervention?
What are you talking about? Of course we should use the military when our national security is threatened or if an ally is.

It doesn't matter who they're attacked by.
Okay, you don't get it.

Do you really think Iraq is going to attack Israel, through the nation of Syria, anytime this decade?


Elaborate on what? Be more specific.
You literally said in your last post that Iraq "definitely" had weapons of mass destruction. I asked for your evidence.

What are you talking about? Of course we should use the military when our national security is threatened or if an ally is.
You haven't backed your claim that the Iraqi government poses a threat to the Israeli nation. You later used this statement to justify the destruction of the Iraqi government, so I think it deserves some explanation.

Blackflag: Do you really think Iraq is going to attack Israel, through the nation of Syria, anytime this decade?
I never said that they would. I'm saying they have attacked Israel before, so they obviously don't like them very much, so we should be on guard.

You literally said in your last post that Iraq "definitely" had weapons of mass destruction. I asked for your evidence.
I never said "definitely", but here it is. http://www.defense.gov/News/NewsArticle.aspx?ID=15918

You haven't backed your claim that the Iraqi government poses a threat to the Israeli nation. You later used this statement to justify the destruction of the Iraqi government, so I think it deserves some explanation.
They attacked them before. http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/january/18/newsid_4588000/4588486.stm

Krazy: I never said "definitely", but here it is
Yes, in 1984, we opened a contract with Saddam Hussien, offering him illegal chemical weapons at low rates, in his war against Iran. He later used those weapons on his own people.

If you read up on those chemical weapon staches, they are 20 years old and all traced back to the United State.

I do not know your criteria for weapons of mass destruction, but chemical infantry grenades and air bombs are not weapons of mass destruction. At least not classified as such under the Geneva Convention.

They attacked them before
Actually false. They launched scud missiles at US, UK, and French military establishments in Israel, when they were already in a state of formal war with the Coalition.

It is totally different in a lot of respects. Also, that was 1991, when Saddam was still in power. What makes you think Iraq is a threat to Israel now?

Blackflag: Iraq had WMDs according to the US DoD. It says it right there on their website. And Iraq did attack Israel, specifically Tel Aviv. I don't know what to tell you lol.

The attack was in 1991; very recent. And since Iraq is an essentially muslim country, they pose a threat to Israel.

I'm not going to continue to debate in this forum, this is exhausting.